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Dev Diary #132 – Eccentricity & Adoption

Eccentric​

Hello hello hello, welcome to another Wards and Wardens dev diary! Today I'm going to be talking you through two new features: adoption and the Eccentric trait! We'll start off with the simpler of the two features: Eccentricity.

Why add a new trait in Wards and Wardens?​

Friends and Foes added the Loyal and Disloyal traits, but unfortunately these came quite late in development and as a consequence they were quite under-utilized, so we decided to have the discussion around new traits quite early this time around and we went over a few different ideas including Superstitious, Silly vs Serious, but we kind of knew all along that what we really wanted was something analogous to the Wild Wasteland trait in Fallout or CK2 Lunatic.

For those unfamiliar, Lunacy in CK2 was usually where we made our more… out there content. There are still echoes of this here and there in CK3, but for the most part, Lunacy isn't really the same as it was.
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The decision was made quite early in CK3's development that the lunatic trait would be analogous to real-world mental illness so this kind of content was typically deemed inappropriate. As a result of that decision, we've not really had an easy way to gate the sillier side of things when it comes to the player character. This has been a bit of a divisive subject on the forums, so we felt we needed some way to gate the content without resorting to game rules.

What is Eccentric? Who is Eccentric?​

Eccentric is a personality trait meaning it is an essential part of a character's personality. Eccentrics are erratic and irrational, but there is a method to the madness so they may be able to see things that other characters don't.
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Numbers are subject to balancing

Wards and Wardens being all about children and childhood made it the perfect fit for a new Personality trait, and as with all other Personality traits in the game, Eccentric can be acquired during childhood.
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People have been known to lose their marbles later in life, so a particularly stressed character may have a mental break which causes them to start seeing things in a more Eccentric way.
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As you can see in the below screenshot, a non-Eccentric child would just guess at the options presented to them, but an eccentric may think of something a bit more creative.
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There has also been an audit of some existing content to add checks for the Eccentric trait where sensible. The now-infamous Cat-apult event, for example, has now been made into an Eccentric event.

Something I'd like to nip in the bud quite early is that the Eccentric trait is not intended to reflect any real-world disabilities, illnesses, or neurodivergence. I think it's wonderful if you are able to project some of your own experiences onto the trait, but making a direct and conscious effort to make the Lunatic trait analogous to real-world mental illnesses is the reason why we ended up making Eccentric to begin with and we'd rather not have to come up with another trait for our silly content.

Eccentric is a free feature and will be available to everyone, but some unique content related to the trait will be exclusive for DLC-owners.

Adoption​

Now onto the next feature of this diary and one that's quite exciting to me personally is the Adoption interaction! Now many many patches ago we introduced the Same-Sex marriage rule and ever since then it's just kind of been there and we've yet to introduce a way to actually make same-sex play… well, playable.

Who can adopt?​

Under the default game rules, Adoption is available to characters who are in a same-sex marriage, the childless and elderly/infertile, and Compassionate characters. Compassionate has long been a bit of a weak trait to have, so it's nice to give them a powerful way to secure succession and bring talented orphans into the family.
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Who can be adopted?​

Children can be adopted as long as: they're not a ruler, they're not in prison or otherwise unavailable, nobody in their family is a ruler, they're not already part of your house, and they're not in the realm of someone of their dynasty. This does mean you're technically allowed to adopt noble children, and children whose parents are still alive, but they are highly reluctant to accept adoption in those circumstances.

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Noble Adoption​

If you want to role-play a culture where adoption is commonplace (as it was in some off-map and out-of-period cultures), you can take up the Noble Adoption cultural tradition!

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Hold on a minute, isn't this anachronistic?​

Sort of! While adoption amongst nobility was exceptionally rare, it wasn't completely unheard of. As such, we've restricted access to adoption quite a lot as described and the AI is quite reluctant to do it.

Can the restrictions be loosened?​

Absolutely! Adoption comes with three new game rules that can forbid it or make it easier!
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Just like the Eccentric trait, Adoption is part of the free update releasing with Wards & Wardens on August 22nd. Next week we will talk about the new Court position and share more details on what to expect from this event pack. See you then!
 
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Will it also be possible for childless rulers to adopt adults as a matter of succession formality, as was sometimes done by the Byzantines?
I believe good ol' Emperor Basil in 867 start was actually formally adopted by his predecessor Michael as part of a convoluted series of succession shenanigans.
 
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One thing to note is during the period of the 5 good Emperors (this is WAY before the CK3 timeline). Emperors adopted their future designated heirs.

I believe the Byzantine and Latin heritages should at least be given a discount for the new tradition.

Do you guys remember the starting character in the map who's a Eunuch? I guess no more convoluted shenanigans necessary.

This suggestion is brought to you by the Guild of Millers. The Guild uses only the finest grain. True Roman Bread for True Romans.
 
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How will adopted children show in family tree?
Let's say a child's parents died and a male ruler adopts them.
Does it then show the male ruler as the new father with no mother depicted with the child's parentage completely replaced, or will it show the deceased mother as still being the mother of the adopted child while "erasing" the original dead father?
imo there should be a way to view original parentage of an adopted child if there is one
 
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can i ask what the ai values are for the eccentric trait? i feel like theres already more that tanks the honor and compassion values than raises them so id personally prefer if it doesnt touch those for balance reasons, but blasting rationality certainly makes sense to me
 
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Will it also be possible for childless rulers to adopt adults as a matter of succession formality, as was sometimes done by the Byzantines?
I believe good ol' Emperor Basil in 867 start was actually formally adopted by his predecessor Michael as part of a convoluted series of succession shenanigans.
Currently adoption is only available on children, so adult adoption like this is not available at this time.
Does this mean that enabling same-sex marriages will no longer disable achievements?
This has not actually been touched, but I'll raise it with the rest of the team because it's a good conversation to be had, nice suggestion!
One thing to note is during the period of the 5 good Emperors (this is WAY before the CK3 timeline). Emperors adopted their future designated heirs.

I believe the Byzantine and Latin heritages should at least be given a discount for the new tradition.
I believe I did give Roman culture the tradition but I'm unsure. A discount for having some form of Roman-adjacent heritage is not a bad idea though.
How will adopted children show in family tree?
Let's say a child's parents died and a male ruler adopts them.
Does it then show the male ruler as the new father with no mother depicted with the child's parentage completely replaced, or will it show the deceased mother as still being the mother of the adopted child while "erasing" the original dead father?
imo there should be a way to view original parentage of an adopted child if there is one
When you adopt a child, they become part of your house and you become their father/mother. The game already has a behind-the-scenes "real" father, and a "real" mother has been introduced for adoption. "Real" in CK terms refers to a child's biological lineage and it doesn't show up on the family tree except in the case of bastardry and such.
can i ask what the ai values are for the eccentric trait? i feel like theres already more that tanks the honor and compassion values than raises them so id personally prefer if it doesnt touch those for balance reasons, but blasting rationality certainly makes sense to me
Absolutely, these are the current AI values attached to Eccentric:
ai_rationality = dominant_negative_ai_value
ai_honor = low_negative_ai_value
ai_boldness = very_high_positive_ai_value
ai_sociability = low_negative_ai_value
Eccentrics are not callous, they're just very absorbed in their own way of thinking so they're likely to take actions very impulsively, so massively negative rationality and increased boldness are the main takeaways here. Numbers are still subject to balancing and changing.
 
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I really fail to see the logic in avoiding including "any real-world disabilities, illnesses, or neurodivergence".
Depression is in the game, so is paranoia, people can get maimed or incapable, but these are different somehow ?
I think would be great to add more realism to the characters, like addiction, compulsive behaviour, phobias, traumas, and whatnot, the easily offended be damned.
 
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It's interesting you used a Muslim culture for the adoption example. I think they have particular rules for adoption, like you can't change the child's family name if you adopt them.
 
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Adoption is nice. You could avoid some headaches with it. Will the adopted children get a debuff-trait as countermeasure? Similar to Bastard or Legitimized Bastard?

For Roleplaying it is not bad at all. But I would love to have some extra choice for Eunuchs and Monks to adopt from their own dynasty with a heavy prestige hit and a potential rivalry with the former heir.
 
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I really fail to see the logic in avoiding including "any real-world disabilities, illnesses, or neurodivergence".
We don't avoid these things as a rule, we just don't want Eccentric to be something that is explicitly representing something real. The type of content we want to make for Eccentric just doesn't align with these conditions, but it doesn't mean we're opposed to covering these things in the future.
the easily offended be damned.
I don't know, I think it would be quite reasonable to be offended if we had a trait that was explicitly supposed to be autism and then had those characters do CK2 lunatic shenanigans, it's just not how neurodivergence works and it just wouldn't be good content in my opinion.
 
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Adoption is nice. You could avoid some headaches with it. Will the adopted children get a debuff-trait as countermeasure? Similar to Bastard or Legitimized Bastard?

For Roleplaying it is not bad at all. But I would love to have some extra choice for Eunuchs and Monks to adopt from their own dynasty with a heavy prestige hit and a potential rivalry with the former heir.
Adopting someone can upset your potential heirs since they now have to share their inheritance with this new kid in the family, especially if the adopted child is older than them. Adopting does also come at a prestige and renown cost (piety too if you're adopting a child of a different faith), but this cost is reduced by the Noble Adoption cultural tradition.

There is no Adopted trait since any modifiers attached to such a trait would be highly contextual and cultural, but rulers can choose to adopt the child and disinherit them at the same time, if they so desire.
 
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Will there be a limit on how many kids I can adopt? Would biological kids dislike/scheme against adopted ones? Can I literally become father of my small nation - 100 kids achievement ?
 
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Regarding adoption,
1. Is it possible to adopt a bastard of my house or dynasty? As after 16 they will found their own dynasty and get bastard founder anyway?
2.What will happen if I adopt my secret illigitimate child that born from a fornicator low-born? Will there be a gossip negative modifier or any extra penalty?
Coz this option mean I can install my illegitimate blood-related heir w/o getting labeled as an adulterer +piety level penalty.

and if it's possible what will happen if someone expose my bastard secret?
"My son is actually my son!!?" Meme incoming?
 
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